Joe Biden accused of inappropriate behavior towards a second woman in 2009

Joe Biden at the presentation of the 2018 Liberty Medal to George W Bush and Laure Bush at The National Constitution Center

I was a little bit surprised by some of the reactions yesterday to the Joe Biden story. Last Friday, a Democrat named Lucy Flores told her story about feeling very uncomfortable when Joe Biden stood too close to her, smelled her hair and kissed the back of her head. That happened in 2014, in the middle of a mid-term election. I guess I was confused why so many commenters (and political commentators) acted like this kind of story is brand new information? While Lucy Flores was the first woman to ever come out and say publicly that Biden behaved inappropriately, we all have eyes and we’ve known about Biden for a while.

To be clear – and I said this yesterday too – I believe Biden when he says that it was never his intention to make anyone feel uncomfortable. But I also believe Lucy Flores. Both things can be true: she felt uncomfortable and she believed he behaved inappropriately, AND that was never his intention. I also don’t believe Flores told her story as part of some Bernie Sanders or Beto conspiracy. If anything, Flores did Biden a long-term favor by telling her story before he got around to announcing his candidacy. Now he knows that if he does run, his campaign will be engulfed with these MeToo-adjacent stories from all of the women and girls he’s held too tightly, given lingering head-kisses to and/or to whom he’s given unwelcome shoulder-rubs. Speaking of, another Democrat has come forward with a Biden story:

A Connecticut woman says Joe Biden touched her inappropriately and rubbed noses with her during a 2009 political fundraiser in Greenwich when he was vice president, drawing further scrutiny to the Democrat and his history of unwanted contact with women as he ponders a presidential run

“It wasn’t sexual, but he did grab me by the head,” Amy Lappos told The Courant Monday. “He put his hand around my neck and pulled me in to rub noses with me. When he was pulling me in, I thought he was going to kiss me on the mouth.”

Lappos posted about the alleged incident on the Facebook page of Connecticut Women in Politics Sunday in response to a similar account by former Nevada legislator Lucy Flores, which comes as Biden is considering a 2020 run for president. Flores accused Biden of kissing her on the back of her head in 2014, when she was a candidate for lieutenant governor.

Lappos, 43, who is now a freelance worker with nonprofit agencies, said she felt extremely uncomfortable when Biden approached her at the 2009 fundraiser for U.S. Rep. Jim Himes, D-4th, where she was volunteering. At the time, Lappos was a congressional aide to Himes, who she said was not in the room when the incident took place.

“I never filed a complaint, to be honest, because he was the vice president. I was a nobody,” Lappos said. “There’s absolutely a line of decency. There’s a line of respect. Crossing that line is not grandfatherly. It’s not cultural. It’s not affection. It’s sexism or misogyny.”

[From The Hartford Courant]

I believe her. “There’s absolutely a line of decency. There’s a line of respect. Crossing that line is not grandfatherly. It’s not cultural. It’s not affection. It’s sexism or misogyny.” I would go more for “it’s a lack of respect, it’s a lack of boundaries, and one which he exhibits almost exclusively with women and girls.” And yes, I know – Donald Trump is a sexual assailant. But we’re all capable of acknowledging that AND acknowledging that “Uncle Joe” needs to keep his hands to himself.

Again, it feels like we’ve always known about this. We’ve always known that if he ever ran for office again, there would be some kind of reckoning on how grabby and touchy and inappropriate he is. What sucks – politically – is that older people really do love him, and older Democrats would have loved a Biden candidacy in 2020. I really hope it doesn’t happen. If he does announce, this is what the next year will be – women coming forward to talk about how Biden can’t keep his hands or lips to himself.

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Photos courtesy of Getty and Avalon Red.

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105 Responses to “Joe Biden accused of inappropriate behavior towards a second woman in 2009”

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  1. Missskitttin says:

    10 years ago? What did he do though? Why is he being judged with a standard different than what the one we use for say, our president?

    • Kitten says:

      10 years ago when he was 66 and old enough to know better. Or maybe he really DOESN’T know better because no one has informed him that his behavior is inappropriate. Maybe that’s why he just kept doing it. But even so, it definitely started because of that male privilege that allows men to think that they’re entitled to a woman because she’s sharing a public space with them.

      And I judge the President’s behavior HARD and I always have. What Biden has done (so far at least) is not cool, but in no way, shape, or form is it the same as the accusations that have been leveled at Trump. So yeah, I agree with you about the nauseating hypocrisy coming from the Right. I just ignore all of them when it’s the topic of mistreatment of women. They have no moral standing whatsoever thus their opinion is worthless, null, and void.

      • Megan says:

        Biden is genuinely befuddled as to why women take offense to what he considers supportive gestures. This suggests to me that he Is out of touch with the progressive movement and he isn’t willing to change. Given all that has happened over the past two years with #metoo its kind of amazing that his first reaction was to have his spokesperson issue a statement that justified, rather than apologized, for his behavior.

      • Kitten says:

        Yup. He should know better and ITA that the “apology” was garbage.

      • Darla says:

        “I agree with you about the nauseating hypocrisy coming from the Right. I just ignore all of them when it’s the topic of mistreatment of women. They have no moral standing whatsoever thus their opinion is worthless, null, and void.”

        Yes! It’s so easy to do once you practice, you will love it, try it!

    • Muffy says:

      Exactly, plus women in the photos being used as “evidence” against him are saying that these were supportive gestures and they appreciated him for making them. This is an effort to take down the strongest (in name recognition) candidate.

      • jennifer says:

        If Joe doesn’t have to answer for this, he will have to answer for what he didn’t do when he headed the Senate Judiciary Committee during the Anita Hill hearings. He KNEW there were at least 2 other women who wanted to give testimony in support of Anita Hill and he didn’t call them. He also drafted the terrible 2005 predatory bankruptcy bill; a love song to the credit card industry in his home state of Delaware. No more chapter 11 bankruptcy for the individual. Now you can only declare chapter 7 and still are on the hook to the credit card companies; even in the event of a catastrophic illness or injury. His son Hunter works for the Ukrainian National oil company and Joe went over there in 2015 to make a big speech on the company’s behalf; a company whose owner has long standing ties to Putin.
        https://www.nytimes.com/2015/12/09/world/europe/corruption-ukraine-joe-biden-son-hunter-biden-ties.html

        Joe has had 2 times at running for president. He is creepy, handsy, and has never missed an opportunity to go to bat politically for Republicans (they are not the enemy-Pence is a very honorable person) while railing against Dems for being “partisan”. No thanks!

      • Megan says:

        Well said, Jennifer. Biden is so entrenched in the system I don’t think he can think big anymore. And the US needs some really big ideas to clean up the election system, address income inequality, and mitigate climate change.

      • Nikki says:

        Awesome post Jennifer!!

      • BorderMollie says:

        Agree, Megan. Even without his grossness, he’s a corporate dem who always bats for the military industrial complex. We need someone with a much bolder vision for a world facing climate disaster (12 years left, remember!) so imo he shouldn’t be running either way.

    • Jensies says:

      WaPo had a pretty bad take on this this weekend, put it off like nbd, he’s just from a bygone era. NOPE. Not good enough.

    • Yes Doubtful says:

      Exactly. None of these are crimes. He definitely needs to respect the personal space of others, but he’s not a sexual predictor. Even if Obama ran in this day in age, there would be some woman out there who is offended by the time he touched her back. I mean, it’s getting ridiculous.

      • BchyYogi says:

        Agreed, YD, & Let me know when we have an AI candidate with absolutely ZERO human flaws? This is getting pathological. Dems need to use a play from team trump and start defending the most rote of humanity instead of roasting our own. Whose going to run agains the orange fascist in 2020? A pile of ashes???

  2. HayleyK says:

    Agreed, we’ve seen this behavior from him for years. I feel like his best move may just be to say, “I didn’t realize I was making people uncomfortable, I’m so sorry, and I will no longer do this again, ever.” Maybe? I don’t know if that’s enough, or if it should be enough, but I personally think it’s probably his best bet. And then, of course, to actually follow through and not behave like this again.

    • Kitten says:

      I get what you’re saying and I expect a lot of people are just waiting to forgive him but he’s been (assumedly) engaging in this behavior for his entire life. I mean, he’s 76 does it really matter if he ceases this behavior going forward? The damage is done I think. I like Joe but we all knew his baggage would come back to haunt him. He should take the L and go home.

      • HayleyK says:

        Oh, I totally agree with you on all this. And it’s annoying af that people are looking for anyway to excuse this behavior. It’s not okay. I like Joe, but I SO wish he wouldn’t run. However, I don’t think he’s going to step aside. I guess in that regard, my comment was mostly just thinking out loud what his best PR move might be.

        However, I am 100% Team Warren (and also open to a few other candidates, none of which are white men) and really wish that Joe would duck out of consideration.

      • Kitten says:

        Yay! I’m also 100% in for Warren. I even bought my cat a “Purrsist” collar ;)

        I’ve been following a ton of Warren-supporters on Twitter because if I didn’t, my TL would automatically be all Biden, Sanders, and Mayor Pete. It’s been great to open up Twitter and see people talking about Warren’s policies and sharing vids of her etc. Sad that the media doesn’t care, but nice to see that others do :)

  3. B n A fan says:

    He’s judge differently because we have a Con man in the White House who will beat this drum like a dead mule even though he has done way more dispictable things than this. However, joe behavior has been, IMO, creepy for many, many years. I don’t believe he should run. If Hillary had to take her lumps he has to, his time has passed. Btw, Hillary was the most quality in the field at the times when she ran, and they ganged up on her and we have to live with 45 this Con man.

    • Kitten says:

      Good morning, BNA Fan, and I agree with you. The Dems don’t need this shit right now.

      • B n A fan says:

        @kitten, thank you. We have many good people running and we still have not seen the entire field. If we stay focus we will will. I don’t believe the country can stand another six years with the lies, confusions, hate and division caused by this man.

      • Purplehazeforever says:

        There’s a huge difference between predation, harassment, misogynistic treatment of women & Biden’s behavior. I don’t doubt that Biden made them uncomfortable but if he didn’t know or wasn’t told, how is anyone comfortable calling him creepy? To him it could be just be grandfatherly. He is 76.

      • Kitten says:

        Except it doesn’t matter what HE thinks. All that matters in these situations is how he made another person feel.

        And isn’t that sort of the basic standard in how we treat one another? If I unintentionally hurt someone I don’t say “sorry your feelings got hurt” I say “sorry I hurt your feelings.” Because even if I didn’t intend to hurt the person, their feelings are VALID and deserve recognition. It’s imperative in that situation to own your behavior and to make amends.

        This shouldn’t be something that needs explaining at his age. If your actions have unintended consequences then you’re probably doing it wrong.

      • Purplehazeforever says:

        Lightpurple touches on this further down…his behavior is inappropriate but it’s doesn’t rise to level of harassment unless it’s a staffer or co-worker & it’s not assault. And further down Annaloo makes an excellent point about Trump many commenters are missing on these posts. I want Trump out. His behavior triggers me on a daily basis, while I find Biden completely harmless. I’m afraid that we are concentrating on purity tests & ideology when we need to simply just break this down. What’s going to attract independent voters to vote for the Democratic ticket? How do we get new voters on board? Trump has completely abandoned the middle to cater to the right & Democrats shouldn’t make the same mistake, either. He can be beat but not if we keep repeating the same mistakes over & over.

    • B n A fan says:

      I’m comfortable calling this behavior “creepy” when I see him going behind a woman without her even knowing he was about to touch her and then kissing on the cheek, neck or head, is in appropriate. I have been saying, to my family and friends, his behavior would freak me out a long time ago. He should know better because I’m sure he was told on the QT to cut it out. Btw, there are some creepy grandfathers out there pretending they don’t know their touching ect is not wanted.

    • 90sgirl says:

      Well said BNA fan.
      His time has passed. I like him, but he already had problems because of the Anita Hill past issue.
      Its true, Hillary was the most qualified to run as President Obama stated many, many times over the campaign, but the media (wanted the TV ratings the Orange one gave them) and GOP and some others focused on emails and pounded basically it to death.

      Joe Biden if he does run will be getting hit with everything the GOP sees possible as a way to damage him. This is just the start of it. Also I don’t trust the media for the most part, they like the TV ratings, more than anything.

      I’d rather see the new crop of candidates run and get the nomination.

  4. 90sgirl says:

    I like several of the new Candidates in the running. Kamala Harris, Buttiege, Booker.

    I like Joe Biden, but He has run for President about three times on his own and NEVER won the nomination on his own. He was great as VP, but I would rather see someone from the current new crop of candidates get the nomination.

    Also even before this story, just with the Anita Hill history, he had baggage.

    Has he even announced he is running yet?

    • Snazzy says:

      Yes, why isn’t his role in the Anita Hill story being discussed more? I didn’t even know about that until I heard it on the radio this morning.

    • BchyYogi says:

      Who TF doesn’t have “baggage”? Seriously, we are comparing the Biden carry on to the orange pile of GARBAGE. DEMS need to stop cremating and start defending. Ghandi wasn’t ‘even a ghandi, so let’s stop holding candidates up to sainthood that does not exist.

  5. mycomment says:

    creeper behavior that’s just never been called out before; but ‘me too’ has changed that. regardless, he just needs to step back. he could play the roll of senior pol, raising money for the party and advocating the issues.
    but a hell no for president.

  6. Anastasia says:

    I like Biden, generally speaking. I just don’t know that we need another old white man running for President. You know?

    (I do believe her, but Flores is also a huge Bernie supporter, so part of me is thinking, “hmmm…”)

    • Myrtle says:

      I’d like to see some fresh blood in the White House, too. But at least not all old white men are *clueless* sexist misogynists like Biden. Like him or not, Senator Sanders hasn’t been accused inappropriate behavior with women. His long standing equal rights for all stance and feminist values even led Gloria Steinem made him an “honorary woman” more than 20 years ago!

      • BchyYogi says:

        Sanders bernie bros didn’t come from Nowhere, there is OBVIOUSLY a strain of misyogyists amoung that camp- stop the bernie or bust sh*t, it got us into this current orangeHell. C’mon. Methinks the whole biden as creepy is a bernie troll issue. we. are. F”d. Seriously. With all the in faction fighting I’m about get an oversized red maga hat and join the handmaiden brigade. Doomed.

  7. AnnaKist says:

    Well, that’s him done, now…

  8. lucy2 says:

    The best thing he could do is a sincere apology, CHANGE HIS BEHAVIOR, and decline to run but pledge to do whatever he can to help whoever gets the nomination. If he does still run and gets the nomination, I will be disappointed, but I’d still vote for him over Trump. Unhappily, but Trump is still worse. Far worse.

    I’d be curious to know if there are any men who have dealt with him who think he’s too touchy-feely. Somehow I doubt it.

    • Who ARE These People? says:

      All the reports and all of the videos are of Biden with women.

      • Lightpurple says:

        Since most of the videos have been put together by Trump supporters for the purpose of attacking Biden, they wouldn’t include men.

        Several men have come forward to say they were unexpectedly hugged by Biden but thought nothing of it. The ones expressing discomfort are all women.

        He shouldn’t be hugging anyone other than close friends and family.

      • lucy2 says:

        Thanks lightpurple.
        I don’t want to say that makes me feel better about it, as he is clearly making people uncomfortable, but if it is women AND men, to me that says it’s less a sexism/harassment kind of thing and more that he’s just inappropriately touchy feel.
        Still not good, of course. People need to keep their hands to themselves, especially in a professional environment!

      • Who ARE These People? says:

        Thanks for the clarification. It’s still the women adding details about additional touches that he hasn’t inflicted on the men, and as women are sensitized due to constant intrusion on their persons, it remains a problem. He just sounds incredibly needy and inappropriate, and we know from his gaffes he has problems with impulse control. Given his age and its likelihood of getting worse even if he stays cognitively healthy for his age, I hope he doesn’t run.

  9. Mabs A'Mabbin says:

    It’s time for new politicians. It’s time for progressive change. It’s time for younger, fresher dedication to the future of our country and positive global relationships. It’s time to discard fear, division and nihilism. It’s time to restore confidence in the life experience with respect for all, but at the same time appreciate our differences and not take everything too seriously which escalates and fuels dissent. It’s time to shut haters out, ignore their insanity and not let them try to weasel out of their predicament with false psychosis declarations (Alex Jones). It’s time to call it like we see it and not allow their passive aggressive mantras to anger us. I think my new word will be psychosis. So many supporters believe conspiracy theories and their official leader has voiced his inability to determine what’s real and what isn’t. No more hate. No more anger. One word for deplorables…psychosis.

    • KHLBHL says:

      Could not agree with you more. I hate to suddenly proselytize, but since CNN, MSNBC, and other mainstream media are not giving a fair amount of time and consideration toward him, I’d like to just bring up Andrew Yang. If you don’t know much about him, check out his interview on The Breakfast Club. You don’t have to agree with him on everything, but watching that interview really made me think about things differently about our country’s future. He is saying a lot of the same things as Pete Buttigieg (and Yang was saying these things a lot earlier than Pete). The two of them both have a really hopeful message. I just think AY’s policies are much more definitive. I know we have a fantastic field of candidates but I’d like to focus the spotlight on people who are getting less mainstream attention. They might not become our chosen candidate, but I think their specific policies are worth serious consideration.

  10. Who ARE These People? says:

    It doesn’t matter what he says his “intention” was, it matters how his targets felt, and that’s all they seem to have been to him – targets.

    There’s no bright line between what he did and what Trump did because the behaviors of both men exist on a continuum from ogling to catcalling to inappropriate touching to harassment to rape (and from there to the murder of women).

    Everyone interested please look up Rebecca Traister’s devastating New York magazine piece on Biden’s legislative history. He’s not the White Obama; he was chosen with great care to give Obama cover with traditional white men voting for Democrats. Traister gives him his due for later work but come on, he still has not apologized to Anita Hill and he still acts like there’s nothing he could have done. As well, lots of money from big finance in Delaware, and so much more. Just have a look.

    He never won on his own merits for a reason and his votes have not consistently been in favor of the working class.

    • Darla says:

      Yep his voting record is awful. I never forgot the bankruptcy bill believe me.

      I was talking to someone about 08 yesterday, and we both agreed Obama choosing Biden would not fly today. Things are changing fast. Obama chose Biden for exactly the reason you said. Today, no man, white OR black, could get away with beating a woman in a near tie! for the nomination, and then choosing a white dude for his VP. Wouldn’t happen. They are no longer permitted to even think about doing that. Their base would uprise. and I will tell you something, been a long time coming and I am happy about that if little else.

      • Myrtle says:

        I wonder if Obama offered Hillary VP and she turned him down? He did make her Secretary of Defense, right off the bat…

  11. Anilehcim says:

    This creep has been getting away with pressuring women and young girls to put up with his bullshit for years, and he has been getting away with it. I just went through a photo album that another media outlet has out, it’s about 20 pics long, and it’s just a series of photos of him being inappropriate with women and girls who were visibly uncomfortable. He has not only been smelling hair and planting unwanted kisses on people, he’s also been pressing his body up against women. Joe Biden has a real need to exert power over the opposite sex.

    I had an elderly uncle who notoriously grabbed the asses of the women in our family that he found attractive. He would say stuff to me at family events where we saw each other, including that he would pay me just to watch me walk across the room. It was supposed to be funny, and people laughed. When I was vocal that it bothered me, my older cousin, who was a prosecutor specializing in sexual assault cases at the time (she is now a judge) told me that I needed to lighten up because he’s harmless. I wonder how she would feel if he was alive today to do it to her daughters. It made me uncomfortable and it was inappropriate, gross, and creepy. Eventually we stopped going places he would be. Because my whole family knew about this and pretty much enabled it, my parents and me were made to feel like we were the ones who were wrong because we were vocal about disliking it. There is ALWAYS some shitty, fucked up element of “oh, that’s just how so-and-so is, come on, he’s harmless!” and that needs to STOP.

    Let’s please be done with the days when any of us write off this behavior as harmless because the guy doing it has white hair. Joe Biden has been called “uncle Joe” for a while now. IDK whose uncle he is, but he damn sure isn’t mine. Fuck this guy and all guys like him.

    • Darla says:

      Im sorry. I completely understand. You are 100% right.

    • PunkyMomma says:

      My parents had a couple they enjoyed socializing with from time to time. The man was a creeper. One visit (I was nine at the time) I came down from my bedroom (per parent’s request) to wish them goodnight. I was in a pink robe that tied in front. Creeper grabbed one side of the tie to open the bow, right in front of everyone. The wife grabbed him and I took off up the stairs terrified.

      As a #metoo survivor, and after years of therapy, I’ve come to recognize creepers know exactly that their actions are wrong. That’s why they come up behind a woman and do sh*t like sniff their hair.

      And as a rape survivor (and I think I can state this as true, from at least the women I’ve spoken with) DO NOT EVER come up behind me and put your hands ANYWHERE on me. If you need me to move, just say “excuse me, I need to get by,” or whatever. Just don’t put your hands on me without my consent.

    • Pinetree13 says:

      Exactly. I don’t understand why he’s being defended so much on here!!

  12. Lightpurple says:

    What Biden did was inappropriate and wrong and these women have every right to say they felt uncomfortable. He needs to consider that, apologize, and STOP it. And he shouldn’t run.

    BUT, and this is a huge BUT. There are varying levels of inappropriate behavior. Indeed, there are various crimes based upon varying levels of inappropriate behavior. What Biden did was wrong but it should NOT be equated with the behaviors alleged to Brett Kavanaugh or Donald Trump. Unless Biden did this to co-workers or subordinates, there would not even be a cause for a sexual harassment claim, certainly nothing criminal. Brett Kavanaugh stands accused of sexual assault and attempted rape; Joe Biden does not. Donald Trump stands accused of countless cases of sexual assault and actual rape.

    Trump’s supporters are gleefully accusing Biden of worse behavior than Kavanaugh or Trump and what we have seen simply does not reach that level.

    Unwanted touching is not okay and it is not professional and it is wrong. We all have a right to our own bodies, a right to respect. But an unwanted friendly hug is not the same as rape; that’s why one is a crime and the other is not, and we should not allow Trump’s minions to paint them as the same.

    • Kitten says:

      Agree with all of this but as I said above, in the interest of preserving our mental health we must learn to tune out all the Trumpsters on this particular subject. They LIVE for their false equivalencies but the only thing you can do is not engage.

      • Lightpurple says:

        True and I stated the above because I see many going merrily along the path the Trumpets want.

    • Tiffany :) says:

      Good points, Lightpurple.

  13. Rapunzel says:

    The timing on this is definitely shady. I don’t get how anyone can think otherwise. It’s no coincidence that this long known aspect of Biden’s behavior is suddenly front page news right after reports that he was a strong contender to take down Trump. It’s not Beto or Sanders that’s shook. It’s DT.

    • Lightpurple says:

      The MAGAts started attacking Biden and circulating pictures and videos around the time of the Kavanaugh hearings, equating this behavior with Christine Blasey Ford’s charges of attempted rape. They’re going full force now because they think he’s going to announce a run and polls show he would clobber Trump.

      • BchyYogi says:

        Seriously, we should test this theory and “go all in” for any candidate and watch the maga BS–no matter WHO is clobbering trump will get the acidic drench of meme bombing so intense that even liberals jump in to throw stones….

  14. Becks1 says:

    I didn’t think Biden was a good candidate before this; he has a lot of baggage and while I think he might be able to defeat Trump, I think he can also campaign for the dem candidate and be an asset that way.

    I think these stories are problematic; I don’t think it means that Biden is at the same level of Weinstein or trump, but I think its an issue. I do think its an important opportunity to discuss general physical behaviors. No, it wasn’t sexual harassment or assault, but these women clearly felt uncomfortable and as Flores said, he invaded her space. That’s not okay. And I think its important to get it across to men that not every woman you encounter needs you to touch their shoulders, rub their arms, or whatever. Even if that’s how you, as a man, communicate (through touch etc), you need to learn to take a step back and to respect others space.

    • Lightpurple says:

      We should be using it as a teaching moment for just the reasons you state. Respect our personal space!

  15. Annaloo. says:

    At this point, I think Dens are doing everything to assure Trump’s second term. Their policies are too radical for the average American bc we don’t get out of our bubble
    enough to see that. Lucy should be heard, listened to, but I hate Trump and it may be wrong to feel this way, but I’d rather win than be right if the long game means getting rid of Trump. He has done more harm to the legal authority and autonomy of women than anyone in modern political times. he iis packing our judicial system with conservative judges who do not believe in a woman’s right to vote. He attacks women regularly on their appearance. You can’t tell me Biden is worse than him. Trump MUST be removed from office. EYES ON TRUMP’S DEFEAT – that should be the end goal . That is our biggest problem, Dems haven’t won the presidential election, but behave as tho we have. We cannot ignore that the country is still majority conservative, wake up.

    Get. Rid. Of. Trump. First.

    • Darla says:

      We are working to get rid of trump. This is a primary. We do not have to choose the oldest, whitest man just because that is what makes you feel safe. There is NO guarantee that Biden is best positioned to beat Trump. We have not even had our first caucus. We are entitled to a full airing of our candidates so as a party, we can choose whom we think the best one is.

    • FHMom says:

      This is exactly how I feel. We Dems hold our politicians to higher standards than Republicans do. But what good is being honorable if we lose? I’m not saying pick anybody, just don’t disqualify someone outright because of egregious behavior or a mistake.. Beto apologizing for his comments about his wife was the last straw for me. Trump never apologizes. Amy is a bitch? Good. We need a bitch. Elizabeth Warren fudged her ethnicity? FFS, get over it. We need to get that turd out of office. That is the priority.

      • Annaloo. says:

        (I had meant to say a woman’s right to choose, not right to vote… But with gerrymandering, it may as well be)

        Look, I’m not a Biden apologist, but I’m not goin to worry about the leak in the kitchen when it’s a flood outside. Primaries are where we lose things too, and so far, even with Biden and the current field, I see nothing that will beat the juggernaut that is Trump. I do not underestmate him, or the stupidity and gullibility and self righteousness of his voters. Dems are facing the Evangelical Church,
        the patriarchy and the rich. We cannot underestimate their resources and influence over Trump voters. I don’t know if anyone realizes this, but Rush Limbaugh is STILL the number one radio show in the nation w 15.2 million listeners. Dems are not in a position to assume anything, and it’s fair to say the circular firing squads are worrying. No one is holding Trump to a higher standard bc many do not see that standard and are comfortable with living in a racist, sexist classist society bc it’s all they know. Do not underestmate this.

    • H says:

      Thank you. As I said in the Biden post yesterday, I would vote for Satan at this point if it got Trump out of office. This country cannot take another four years of Trump and his alt right policies. If we get him for another four years the Supreme Court will be done for for the next 30. Yes, Biden has some problems, he needs to address them, change his behavior and if he can beat Trump, which polls say at the moment he could, then he needs to run.

      I am looking at the larger picture, which is the best candidate who can take down that Orange Nightmare, needs to run and WIN.

      • Purplehazeforever says:

        I thank you & annaloo…we are not getting out of our own way & we will definitely pay for it in 2020.

    • Kelly says:

      I agree with you Annaloo. Biden is the only one who stands a chance at beating Trump. He is touchy feely with everyone. He should stop it if he runs though, and he should run.

  16. Aang says:

    He just needs to say “I’m sorry. What I did was wrong. I didn’t realize it at the time but I understand now that my actions, while offered with good intentions, make others feel uncomfortable and violated. I will act more professional going forward. I ask anyone that I offended to please accept my sincere apology.”

    • CER says:

      He’s still having problems with sincerely accepting how much he screwed over Anita Hil.

      • Annaloo. says:

        I’m having problems how this President is screwing over the Supreme Court, immigrants, Puerto Rico, women, people of color, LGBTQ, children at the border, teachers, the poor and so many others…

        What rich life we must lead to pickthe battle from decades ago to hold as the standard that we are not going to get over. The enemy is TRUMP. The undoing of civil and constitutional rights is TRUMP. This is a political war here and you are seriously going to hold Anita Hill over all this? Are you waiting for a perfect candidate? I’m not trying to be rude, but understand that I think it’s fair to ask if you been aware of what has been harming this country since the joke of a Presidential election of 2016?

  17. Bunny says:

    Assuming that his intentions are above board, and he never formed any specific thoughts before acting doesn’t help him much.

    He simply never thought about the women he was rubbing, kissing, sniffing, and petting?

    Like, never thought to ask permission?

    Or did he simply think that they wanted it, because he’s just so awesome?

    Explain how you touch women over and over and over, but have “good intentions”.

    He’s either treating women like objects without opinions or rights, or thinks that what he’s doing is so “okay” they’d be fools to say no.

    Either way, what he did was wrong. Not as wrong as Trump, but really wrong.

    This is a distraction that we don’t need.

    • Darla says:

      Exactly.

      And why do I have to be put into the position of defending this behavior if he is the nominee? I am not defending this, sorry!

  18. Jen says:

    Did he forcibly kiss anyone or grab them by the p*ssy? No? I’m not saying it’s ok, but I think Joe is the least of our worries.

    • Astrid says:

      He has no reason to be touching and kissing women he barely knows. Keep your hands to yourself because it’s not OK

    • insertpunhere says:

      Look, I’ll vote for whoever the Democratic nominee is to get Trump out of office. I will campaign. I will donate. I’m willing to bend even if it isn’t my preferred candidate because I know what the stakes are.

      However, he isn’t as bad as the other guy is not an acceptable standard to me in the primary. We have a wide field of qualified (and some arguably unqualified) candidates. We should be bringing up each of their problem areas and forcing them to acknowledge them and explain why they’re still the best option.

      Also, it’s time for the Democratic party to stop pushing aside women and POC, telling us that they’ll get to our issues next time. “We just need to get through this crisis, then we’ll address your concerns.” The secret is that we never get to next time. We’re always just short of the DNC actually prioritizing our needs because there’s always a bigger “crisis” that only focusing on the needs of cis white men is going to solve.

  19. Yawn says:

    @CreepyJoeBiden Instagram if you want a collection of various incidents, including with young girls. He does weird prom poses with them. He strokes their necks and faces and hair. This is textbook covert sexual harrasment and abuse, just like when that dude gave Ariana Grande a bit of a squeeze. It is so insidious.

    How many rapists think they are raping? How many INTENDED to hurt someone? Plenty of partners and friends have had non-consensual sex because they did not ever learn about consent. But Biden does not have that excuse. He is an educated professional who is knowingly violating workplace proximity boundaries and inappropriately touching women. Shoot, there is even video of some Repub shielding his granddaughter from his attempts to stroke her her face, as if she is a dog or some kind of fuzzy couch or something that he is entitled to put his hands on.

    I will not be coerced into voting for a creepy candidate to try to defeat another creep. This man is absolutely not acceptable. The sliding scale of offenses between him and Trump is a disgusting cop-out that erases the damage ALL of these men’s victims have experienced.

    I am not looking for a perfect candidate. I require, at the very least, that the candidate not have a documented history of assaulting women and girls on live f—ing television.

  20. KBeth says:

    I can not stand “touchy” people. Unless you have a close personal relationship with someone, friends/family…keep your damn hands to yourself.
    We should not have to teach this to an adult male living in polite society.
    I generally like Biden but this behavior can absolutely be regarded as creepy and should not be excused in my opinion.

  21. Lizzie says:

    KEEP YOUR HANDS TO YOURSELF. THE END.

  22. HeyThere! says:

    Looking for a video I saw a few years ago of him awkwardly close to many small children and women who were clearly trying to get away and it was total cringe!!!! A lot while he was VP! He always seemed so nice but that video was CREEPY and never ending.

  23. Darla says:

    I really think that all of you flipping out about holding Joe to a higher standard than Trump, risks 4 more years of trump, are seriously overestimating candidate biden.

    Dude couldn’t get 2 % in any dem primary he ever ran in. He has always been bottom barrel, but everyone thinks 8 years of that Obama shine turned him into the unstoppable biden.

    Nah. He won’t beat trump. He is one of the least likely to beat trump because he cannot ignite the base. And his baggage, which is huge.

    And to be clear, I am NOT saying trump is a sitting duck. Oh no, I do agree with those who say don’t underestimate him, or his garbage supporters. Or his rich friends. Or Russia. But you guys are getting yourselves all upset because you have been convinced by pundits Joe is the guy.

    Joe is not the guy.

    • Who ARE These People? says:

      It’s so early. It’s hard to imagine him prevailing in any of the debates over seasoned competitors who will share the stage. I hope his family prevails upon him to avoid public embarrassment. Go out on a high, Uncle Joe.

    • Kitten says:

      Oh my god THIS ^^^^

      We are NOT desperate. We have plenty of interesting candidates to choose from. Additionally, we are NEVER going to get Trump voters, EVER. They are a lost cause and their opinions about the Left’s chosen candidate is irrelevant. Centrists, moderates and Never-Trumpers will likely vote for ANYONE over Trump.

      It’s the people who DIDN’T vote for Hillary that we should be looking at. And whether it’s because they thought she would win or because they didn’t like her or because they never vote–those are the people we need to galvanize. Those are NOT the old folks that have been consistently and dutifully voting in every election since Truman, it’s the first-time voters and people in their 20s and even 30s.

      And all the people thinking that young leftist voters are just gonna line up for Uncle Joe are absolutely KIDDING themselves.

    • Tiffany :) says:

      When Biden does well, he’s incredible. But when he steps in it, he REALLY steps in it and makes a mess of everything.

      I don’t have faith that he can get through the primaries AND the general election without making horrific gaffes. As VP, he wasn’t the focus 24/7. I don’t know if he can hold up under that intense of a spotlight.

      • Darla says:

        I really don’t believe he can Tiffany. I would be holding my breath the entire time.

  24. Lynne says:

    He harasses women
    His voting record sucks
    He would become president close to the age of 80.
    He is the best candidate?

    • Who ARE These People? says:

      Exactly. It’s early and he has name recognition and people miss Obama. Let’s see what happens.

    • Tourmaline says:

      Right, IMO no one who could turn 80 or older during their term should be elected president. There is a minimum age and there should be a maximum age.

  25. pantanlones en fuego says:

    Nancy Pelosi has a good response to all of these issues; she invites him to join her in the “straight arm club”. “Pretend you have a cold and I have a cold.” (source: The Hill). Nancy goes on to say that she and her family love him and she does not believe that he intended to harass people or make anyone uncomfortable. She says that he is a very affectionate person (which we have all seen, he’s even hung on Obama during press conferences) but that he needs to understand that we are living in a time where it is not the intention of an action but how it is received.

    • Kitten says:

      Imagine having to talk to a 76-year-old man like he’s a f*cking child SMDH…how embarrassing.

    • Keira says:

      I love what Speaker Pelosi said, and that she had the ovaries to give the context that she loves him AND he needs to build his awareness about how his actions are received.

  26. Frotteurism is intentional.

  27. laura-j says:

    I like Joe, I really do. But I don’t want him to run for president. I’ve said that about him touching women for year, like dude, stop they don’t like it. But do I think he is a pervert of a sexual harasser. I think he’s a touchy feely person (I’m one too) and that not everyone likes it. I truly don’t think he knows he is causing people to be uncomfortable, but there have been so many pictures for so many years of women and girls stiffening up at his touch. I got into it with a friend last night and she was so mad people were calling him out. So I said, “How would you feel if Trump came up and put his hands on your neck or kissed your hair?” She flipped out on me not the same thing not the same thing… But it kinda is. (Trump is a million times worse, I was just trying to paint a picture of what it would be like to be comforted or touched by someone you didn’t want to touch you.)

    I have a terrible habit of hugging everyone, so I guess if I was running I’d be problematic too.

    For me the biggest problem is his age. In the race so far I love Kamala and Mayor Pete. But you know what if he is the guy I’ll vote for him. Oh American politics in 2019, how I loathe you.

  28. What Joe Biden does is deliberate. He is intelligent, & cunning. He savors the touches, & savors the memories of them because he is a frotteur.

    • Darla says:

      Wow, I had vaguely knew that word, but not really, I had to look it up. I mean, I don’t know if he is that. I don’t think you know either. (I mean, I wouldn’t die of shock if he was either) Is this Sarah Sanders? Tell the truth and shame the devil Sarah? Kellyanne?

  29. Caty says:

    There is literally dozens perhaps hundreds of pictures and video of him doing this for years with the hands on the shoulders and talking behind a lot of women. I do not understand this new pearl clutching when time and again he has been seen doing this FOR YEARS out in the open and now it’s a problem? Smh….

    • Lynne says:

      I agree with you, why now but many of the photos are disturbing. I was looking at a mosaic of pics, many where he is inappropriate with young girls and I was struck how domineering he was with his embrace . He was clutching so they could not back away. Someone wrote this which I felt was so fitting.

      “It reminds of the “Creepy Uncle Joe Biden” talk I had to have with the girls some years ago.”

  30. JByrdKU says:

    Why would anyone care about this in today’s world? The last leader this country elected was audibly heard commenting that women should be “grabbed by their pu**ies”, or something or other.

    Maybe I’ve become jaded, but I don’t see these accusations have any lasting impact, whether that’s right or not.

    • Lynne says:

      Change cant happen until one starts caring, then acting. I am drawing my line at equality.

  31. Lex says:

    What would Leslie Knope say about this I wonder…